tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post8584814751103592111..comments2024-02-26T02:14:12.562-08:00Comments on RED CANUCK: Democrats to Blame for IraqRed Canuckhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14856310732637244052noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-68976563420946327692007-07-24T23:42:00.000-07:002007-07-24T23:42:00.000-07:00That the misadventure in Iraq will end badly is a ...That the misadventure in Iraq will end badly is a foregone conclusion. I'm amazed that the chickenhawks still use the tired rhetoric that "failure is not an option", and that no one really takes them to task over such a hopelessly flawed premise.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-13456094525145571122007-07-24T20:12:00.000-07:002007-07-24T20:12:00.000-07:00md: This will not end well no matter what. You're ...md: <I>This will not end well no matter what. </I><BR/><BR/>You're right, it won't.Karenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04291881352139075405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-61095396675730598492007-07-24T17:34:00.000-07:002007-07-24T17:34:00.000-07:00I think your post brings up a bigger issue. As mu...I think your post brings up a bigger issue. As much as Americans may have suffered from poor government, they've been particularly ill served by weak and uncritical opposition. The Dems weakness was most devastating in the run-up to war, when most were too cowardly to publicly oppose an invasion (or the Patriot Act and other idiocies of the Bush administration). Now, with the shift in public opinion, some of the Dems have discovered their spines (at least in terms of rhetoric, though sadly not action). <BR/><BR/>I suspect the Dems are internally divided about the political consequences of withdrawal, so by inertia the overall effect of indecision is to "stay the course". No matter whether the pull out is quick or slow, it will be bloody. And Dyer is right...the collaborators are going to be left to be slaughtered. This will not end well no matter what.MDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14393076456828228044noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-38549151017075767712007-07-24T17:09:00.000-07:002007-07-24T17:09:00.000-07:00Anon - Certainly an orderly drawback of troops is ...Anon - Certainly an orderly drawback of troops is what the majority of Americans want, and a majority of Democrats. But the only ways for Congress to do that is to cut off funding, or to initiate impeachment proceedings, or something equally as 'dramatic'. They are quite obviously unwilling to go this route. Could it be because they are afraid of the political backlash they would have to endure (being labelled as 'backstabbers' or worse) and the effect this would have on their presidential hopes?<BR/><BR/>Dyer is pointing out that they may have been set up to take the fall for this no matter how it plays out. So while I'm sure they want the troops out of Iraq sooner rather than later, they have to realize the political reality of their situation. It seems to me they are now just biding their time until the next Presidential election. I mean, for heaven's sakes, Harry Reid was unwilling to even entertain Russ Feingold's call to censure President Bush!<BR/><BR/>It would be wishful thinking to believe that the Dems are not considering their political futures when devising their Iraq policies.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-76592047674237889742007-07-24T16:38:00.000-07:002007-07-24T16:38:00.000-07:00I like Dyer, because he doesn't carry anyone's wat...I like Dyer, because he doesn't carry anyone's water. <BR/><BR/>Anon, with respect, if you don't think the Dem's are playing this politically, choosing their safest option, I think you are being naive.<BR/><BR/>I think they are your best hope, but they have not been, imo, as strong as they should have been.<BR/><BR/>The VP and Pres, should be impeached for instance...Pelosi holds back so as not to look vindictive. Please.<BR/><BR/>I know the Dem's want out, but based on last night's debate, they are split on how.<BR/><BR/>If they could take hold of the gov't now, my belief is that they'd start drawing down and I would hope they would do it in a careful manner....taking into account civilian workers. Localised drawdown, perhaps without announcement.<BR/><BR/>Dyer has been right on this, every step of the way. Isn't it tragic when objectivity seems to hold no sway?Karenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04291881352139075405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-48500788848988964962007-07-24T15:33:00.000-07:002007-07-24T15:33:00.000-07:00While I do think there are some valid points, I do...While I do think there are some valid points, I don't buy the premise that Democrats want to stay in Iraq. I think an orderly drawback of troops is what the majority want. I think they want it because its the right thing to do. But even politically, they would be able to go to the American people and say, "We delivered what you wanted."<BR/><BR/>I think the public can handle a messy, murderous Iraq. Afterall, that is what it is now - except their sons and daughters are in the middle of this. That will be America's shame (and I don't use that word lightly) whether or not the troops remain.<BR/><BR/>Democrats can have all the "will" in the world. But they aren't going to cut off funds to the troops and wear that yoke when soldiers die - nor should they. So until they can reach 60 (which means 10 Republican defectors really willing to vote against Bush for real instead of just speech), they won't have the votes to bring them home. And if Bush vetoes anything, they'll need 66 total votes.<BR/><BR/>It's not rocket science - it's math and constitutional law. <BR/><BR/>I just refuse this spurious argument that "Democrats secretly want the troops to remain." <BR/><BR/>I think Republicans might benefit from that perception so I'm doubly suspicous as that argument (and other red herrings) get play in the media.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7950398981377984560.post-55620481035051007952007-07-24T15:14:00.000-07:002007-07-24T15:14:00.000-07:00Gwynne Dyer is right. Sad and disturbing situation...Gwynne Dyer is right. Sad and disturbing situation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com